Brake Contollers

Submitted: Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 11:05
ThreadID: 85420 Views:2333 Replies:7 FollowUps:13
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I am not really up on trailer brake controllers and bought a Redarc which I have not yet fitted.

Since then I have now learnt that the Redarc does not provide proportional braking to the trailer brakes in line with the effort being applied to towing vehicle brakes ie when breaking the braking effort on the trailer brakes is the same in a crash stop vs a gentle stop (can be adjusted on setup and adjusted on the move if required).

Is there any issue with this type of system compared to others where the braking effort on trailer is proportional to the braking effort of the towing vehicle - ie emergency stop - full braking effort is applied but when just slowing less braking effort i applied.

Advice form those in the know would be appreciated.

Thanks

Garry
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Reply By: Notso - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 11:53

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 11:53
There was a lot of discussion on this topic a while back. Personally, I have used a Redarc for at least 10 years and have had absolutely no problems with it. I tow a caravan and have had the occasion to use emergency braking on a number of occasions and it has always performed faultlessly.

If I was going to fit a new brake controller I would use the Redarc with the remote head on it. This allows the control knob and light to be mounted in a standard switch knock out in the dash with the bulky bit tucked away behind the dash.

AnswerID: 450298

Follow Up By: garrycol - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 12:18

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 12:18
The new one with the remote head is what I have. I just feel it might be a pain to have to continually adjust the braking effort depending on the terrain.
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Follow Up By: Notso - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 12:48

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 12:48
I have never found it a problem. It mostly stays in the one spot but if I'm going to head down a major hill such as the Clyde Mountain, I crank it up a notch.

I have towed the van all over Aus up hill and down and through the major cities and never had any issues.

This is the thread where a lot of discussion went on..Redarc Controllers
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Follow Up By: garrycol - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 15:43

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 15:43
Thanks for that information - looks like my concerns are shared by those who have had the Redarc fitted and in use.
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Follow Up By: Notso - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 15:54

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 15:54
Yeah, there seems to be a group who have had concerns, but I know a lot of happy users too.

Since reading all this I have fired off an enquiry to Redarc re this statement in their document.

"The REDARC range of Electric Trailer Brake Controllers put you in charge… not your trailer. All REDARC brake controllers are capable of operating up to 3 axle trailer brakes, and all operate with a progressive brake application to the level set by the user."

Now this sounds like they have progressive braking up to the limit set by the user. It's a bit ambiguous so I've asked em to explain.
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Reply By: CSeaJay - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 13:45

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 13:45
I have no experience with
Redarc, so please read my reply accordingly

I have a Tekonsha (spell?) P3 which has proportional braking. Having experienced the faultless performance and differentiation between emergency braking (specially in wet or on dirt) and the softer braking in other conditi0ons, I cannot even consider ever going to a non-proportional system.

Hope this helps - not sure what your question is but this is my opinion

CJ
AnswerID: 450308

Reply By: Member - Captain (WA) - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 14:33

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 14:33
Think of it this way, do you like being able to adjust how hard you apply your vehicle brakes by varying your foot pressure - or would you prefer a switch on the dash that simply turns your brakes on or off?

While manually adjustable brake controllers do work, they simply cannot provide optimum brake actuation under different terrains and conditions.

Cheers

Captain
AnswerID: 450311

Reply By: Dennis Ellery - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 15:53

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 15:53
I wouldn’t have an automatic proportional brake controller.
To have the caravan brakes actuated by inertia caused by the slowing of the front vehicle is dangerous in some situations.
I have jack-knifed a trailer at speed with a similar system and it’s a scary experience.
With a manual system; if you get a wobble up you need to apply the caravan brakes first (by a light pressure on the foot pedal – not enough to apply the front vehicles brakes, but enough to actuate its stop lights).
This is especially important when towing a heavy load downhill or at speed over corrugations.
AnswerID: 450317

Follow Up By: olcoolone - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 17:28

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 17:28
So you have never used a proportional brake controller?

Once you have used one you will never go back to a on or off controller again.

With the proportional brake controller you still have full control of the trailer brakes and you can apply them manually with the slid control.

What brand and model was the similar system you had problems with?
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Follow Up By: Dennis Ellery - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 17:43

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 17:43
I know that you can set your auto controller to manual if you wish.
With automatic devices, people usually set and forget – in an emergency it’s too late to start fiddling with knobs to reset the device from auto to manual.
It’s also reassuring to lightly touch the pedal and feel the van brakes come in first when you’re belting along a corrugated road, towing a 3 tonne van.
This not a band bashing exercise - I have towed a 3 tonne van around Australia twice with a manual controller - wouldn't go auto for the reasons mentioned.
Not saying the auto doesn't suit a lot of people - its just not my cup of tea.
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Follow Up By: olcoolone - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 19:15

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 19:15
Dennis I think you really need to try one before saying you don't like it.

You have me lost on this resetting from auto to manual?

So what your saying is you would sooner have an old fashioned brake controller for 1% of the time as opposed to a new tech one for 99% of the time.

Dennis you really need to upgrade and try it.

A proportional brake controller will do every thing one of the old type will plus more and a lot easier.

As asked before have you ever tried the new proportional brake controllers?

An proportional brake controller is so much better in an emergency as it can alter the rate of deceleration to the situation and you can even change the delay of when it will come in.
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Follow Up By: Dennis Ellery - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 19:59

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 19:59
We are only getting sidetracked here, I am not getting into a mine is better than yours argument. It’s all about the method of actuation and I don’t like actuation by backpressure from the front vehicle in risky situations. In other situations I like the way the automatic proportional systems work. It’s a personal choice for me reinforced by a jack-knife incident at speed. We all have different priorities.
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Follow Up By: snoopyone - Tuesday, Apr 05, 2011 at 09:06

Tuesday, Apr 05, 2011 at 09:06
What no one has picked up on is the fact that a Prodigy can be set to come on as you like.
IE It can be set to come on slightly ahead of car brakes thereby applying the van brakes slightly earlier than the car.
This is advantageous in the situation where you may be in danger of jacknifing.

Who has 3 hands to pull on a manual control whilst trying to steer with one hand, maybe trying to change down with the other and what are you going to use on the brake controller...


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Reply By: Member - Boobook - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 16:14

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 16:14
I had one and replaced with a P3 after about 3 months and constant monitoring.

If you can predict in advance all types of traffic conditions, driver behaviour, road types and road conditions every time you brake then the Redarc is for you, but you will have to adjust it just before you brake.

Ditch it and get a P3. The redarc is dangerous IMHO.
AnswerID: 450320

Reply By: Sand Man (SA) - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 18:52

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 18:52
Garry,

There is a lot of hysteria in a couple of the answers by people who are trying to justify their own choice.

Be assured, the Redarc brake controller works very well, in all types of braking situations.
I also have the remote head unit recommended by a camper trailer distributor who use the same unit on their triple axle transport trailer that carries three campers at a time.

I'm not sure how many people use the "backup system" that should be available.

My camper has electric brakes, with a hydraulic override system as a backup.
You should always leave the latch open, so that the hydraulic override brakes will operate in a situation when the electric brakes malfunction.
In normal situations, they will never operate as the electric brakes will be activated before inertia operates the hydraulic coupling.

My previous camper only had the hydraulic actuated brakes and worked OK, although with a noticable "jerk" of the mechanical coupling, mainly when accelerating again after braking. The Redarc controlled electric brakes when adjusted correctly, will operate smoothly and effectively in all situations to apply braking force to the trailer, camper, or caravan, thus assisting the vehicle brakes to slow down and stop the rig effectively.

You have selected an effective electric brake controller mate.


Bill.
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AnswerID: 450342

Reply By: garrycol - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 19:01

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 19:01
Thanks for everyone for the responses - a real mixed bag of pros and cons of the two basic systems.

I guess Redarc have tried to deal with the set and forget con by having remote head`that is easily accessible in changing circumstances or even emergencies to allow the controller to be put on full without having to grope for it.

A proportional system with manual override controls remote from the controller would be the best of all.

Something to think about (insert smiley face here)

Cheers

Garry
AnswerID: 450344

Follow Up By: Sand Man (SA) - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 19:19

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 19:19
Garry,

The standard and remote head units after initial setup will operate in the same effective way.
The only advantage of the remote head unit is that the LED indicator and adjustment knob can be mounted in a more accessible position.

I have not needed to adjust the setting after initial setup.

One other "advantage" of the remote head is that you can operate the trailer brakes without using the vehicle brakes. You do this by pressing the knob which will apply the appropriate braking force as set by the variable rotary knob.

Situations where you would need this are fairly limited, ie. when you are descending a slippery track or slope, activating the brakes of the towed vehicle will limit the effect of the trailer jack knifing, but this would be fairly rare and providing you can mount your normal controller in an accessible position, you will have the same control.


Cheers,
Bill.
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Follow Up By: garrycol - Tuesday, Apr 05, 2011 at 09:15

Tuesday, Apr 05, 2011 at 09:15
With the remote head - in emergency situations you do not have to grope for the knob and turn it to get more braking but just the push button and full braking is applied immediately.

I think the ultimate would be a cross between the two systems.

Cheers

Garry
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Follow Up By: Sand Man (SA) - Tuesday, Apr 05, 2011 at 10:28

Tuesday, Apr 05, 2011 at 10:28
Garry,

Not quite right mate.
When pressing the control knob, the braking force will be activated at the level previously set by adjusting the controller.

The last thing you want is full braking force in any situation as all that will do is lock the wheels up and causing loss of traction.

Any brakes on a towed vehicle should only assist the braking effect of the towing vehicle, not "take over" completely.


Bill.
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Follow Up By: garrycol - Tuesday, Apr 05, 2011 at 15:21

Tuesday, Apr 05, 2011 at 15:21
Yes - your right - silly me.
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