Bullbar, Smart Bar or Alloy

Any bull bar looks ugly.

.
A bull halfway through the radiator looks even uglier!

" I guess it's made of Nylon, "
Polyethylene. Similar material to plastic fuel tanks.
Almost indestructible....

Cheers,
Peter
OKA196 motorhome

Hi Peter, I have never really had a look at a Smart Bar. I guess the bars are very small production runs and are more likely to be Rotationally moulded so Hi Density Polyethylene is a good choice as it would need to be a Polyolefin to use that method of manufacture. Michael.

Yep, that is exactly how they are made, although it is possible to rotomould nylon which I have seen used for small run fuel tanks for motorcycles - why they did not use PE I have no idea....

Cheers,
Peter
OKA196 motorhome

.
Rotational Moulding is a process of placing a measured amount of polymer into a hollow mould which is heated and rotated to distribute the material over the inner surface of the mould. It is generally used for larger hollow products such as tanks.

Are Smartbars hollow?

"Are Smartbars hollow?"
Yes.
Part of the initial development issues involved getting enough polymer powder into the mould to ensure that the wall sections are high enough.
Great process for "handy people" to make low volume tanks such as diesel and water tanks for motorhomes. Make a relatively simple sheet metal mould and get a local rotomoulder to do the moulding. I made water and diesel tanks for the OKA this way.

Cheers,
Peter
OKA196 motorhome

.
Hollow? I'm astonished.
Thanks Peter.

Yes ditto.

I hated my ARB bullbar on my old 200 which ARB said weighed 83 Kg, but was actually 105Kg plus 32Kg for the winch. They wobble all over the place and is way to heavy even with heavy duty springs and shock absorbers. It really affected handling on scalloped tracks and made the front of the vehicle jump up and down on messy dune approaches . It drove me nuts. It even wobbles on a freeway and on a dirt road looks like it is about to fly off.

I too got the smart bar for my new 200. At about 34kg, plus the winch it is a pleasure to own and use. I agree the look grows on you. Love it.

I have an OL bull bar on a 200 series and don't have much shake at all, although it would weigh similar to an ARB one ( also have a winch ). The aerial stays very still most of the time ( I don't use a spring )..

But I just can't get my head around paying 80K for a 4wd and whacking a piece of horrible plastic on the front of it....even if it does the job ??

Why would you want to add a big hunk of steel to the front of your car when a product a fraction of the weight will do the same job? The aesthetic considerations are subjective. Oh wait - you're a LC owner....;-)

Aesthetic's are certainly subjective....but I couldn't park my 4wd in the garage backwards just so I didn't have to look at a piece of black plastic that looks like a couple of school kids designed.

What thing of beauty do you drive seeing as you want to make it personal ?

;-) = you chill out

...if you hit a cow I doubt any roo/bull bar would provide 100% chance of not getting radiator damage ...though would of course depend on speed and point if impact. If you were driving an air cooled car you'd be safe :)

Cheers
Greg

also doesn't upset the caffe latte sipping set who worry about pedestrians being hurt by steel?

Interesting about the vibrations. That persons experience the opposite to what I got going from my ARB bar to the Smart bar. Maybe it's vehicle specific.
Take a look at this video from about 49 seconds in slomo.



That is what my ARB bar was like, it is so heavy it twists the front of the chassis rails. The weight is about 800mm forward of the support for the rails at the front wheels. Jamie who took that attributes it to the body mounts which is the ARB line. but that isn't true ( look at the rear bar - no movement)

The smart bar is rock solid on a dirt road.

Also I hit a large roo at 100kmph when I had the steel ARB bar. I didn't notice any damage until I got home, there was a small crease in the passenger side front panel. The front of the chassis rails bent ever so slightly. They gave way to the bullbar. *000 of chassis realignment later it was fixed. I don't think old design steel bullbars are appropriate any more. The crush cans didn't move or distort...

As you say may be vehicle specific, with the Prado 120, Toyota did a recall and removed the crush cans from the bull bars and replaced with stronger brackets.

It gets back to why you have a bull bar fitted, when we encounter or may encounter cattle we slow down, the bull bar is there for the one we miss, hopefully it will provide enough protection to prevent injury to the occupants and allow you to drive the vehicle out of where you are. Some on the other hand think a bull means your invincible.

Personally I have never found a plastic component that has been as strong as a metal one, I can't therefore see the sense in fitting a plastic bull bar, even if it bounces back, not much point the bull bar looking good if the panel work is damaged. Same for lightness, yes would be nice if it was lighter and as strong but unless it is carbon fiber it is unlikely to be.

Here's some other quotes from the thread:

"Tuff Bar Vs Smart Bar for high Speed Kangaroo strikes.

Gave a late night lift to a couple who hit a medium/ largish roo in a 150 fitted with smart bar in QLD last week.. Said they were doing about 95kmh on impact.
The bar was halfway in to the radiator ( which had also moved back to touching the engine fan...) the Roo was still in there too.. Bonnet, one 1/4 guard, grille, bar, radiator, condenser, and a bunch of other stuff gone..Pretty messy and expensive.

Myself I'll stay with my ARB, that has about 12 smaller/ medium Roo hits to its name now."

"Crossing the nullabor last night.. 4x4 with a smart bar and a roo strike outside belladonia.. Disabled the car, to the point it's been left there to be trucked out for repairs.

We hit a Roo with an East coast bar (ECB) same stretch in the transit race transporter. Dead on the mount point area, cannot even really see where it hit. Apart from some fur and blood. "

"Go the Tuff bar!

I had had 6 x Hiluxes over the past 13 years. The SR 4x4 that I got rid of last year, had a Toyota Steel Bar with Side Rails and a set of Lightforce XGTs. I hit about 12 roos over 3 years with that ute, 3 - 4 big ones, and the bar hardly moved at all. All of the roo strikes were at high speed.

My previous Hilux SR 4x4 had a white smart bar, and when I hit a big roo at 100km/hr between Mildura & Renmark, the roo pretty well destroyed the front end, causing 14k damage, and rendered the car off the road for 8 weeks."

"I have a smart bar. It's had 1 serious strike at its weakest/most flexible point (ie at the outside quarter) and handled it well. I would buy another one as my likely strike rate is low and weight is important to me. Having said that...... If my driving patterns and strike rate were like yours so I had other priorities then would think a big heavy tuff bar would probably win out."

Video of car with tuff bar hitting roo, I wouldn't like to have this happen with a smart bar:

As you say may be vehicle specific, with the Prado 120, Toyota did a recall and removed the crush cans from the bull bars and replaced with stronger brackets.

It gets back to why you have a bull bar fitted, when we encounter or may encounter cattle we slow down, the bull bar is there for the one we miss, hopefully it will provide enough protection to prevent injury to the occupants and allow you to drive the vehicle out of where you are. Some on the other hand think a bull means your invincible.

Personally I have never found a plastic component that has been as strong as a metal one, I can't therefore see the sense in fitting a plastic bull bar, even if it bounces back, not much point the bull bar looking good if the panel work is damaged. Same for lightness, yes would be nice if it was lighter and as strong but unless it is carbon fiber it is unlikely to be.

Here's some other quotes from the thread:

"Tuff Bar Vs Smart Bar for high Speed Kangaroo strikes.

Gave a late night lift to a couple who hit a medium/ largish roo in a 150 fitted with smart bar in QLD last week.. Said they were doing about 95kmh on impact.
The bar was halfway in to the radiator ( which had also moved back to touching the engine fan...) the Roo was still in there too.. Bonnet, one 1/4 guard, grille, bar, radiator, condenser, and a bunch of other stuff gone..Pretty messy and expensive.

Myself I'll stay with my ARB, that has about 12 smaller/ medium Roo hits to its name now."

"Crossing the nullabor last night.. 4x4 with a smart bar and a roo strike outside belladonia.. Disabled the car, to the point it's been left there to be trucked out for repairs.

We hit a Roo with an East coast bar (ECB) same stretch in the transit race transporter. Dead on the mount point area, cannot even really see where it hit. Apart from some fur and blood. "

"Go the Tuff bar!

I had had 6 x Hiluxes over the past 13 years. The SR 4x4 that I got rid of last year, had a Toyota Steel Bar with Side Rails and a set of Lightforce XGTs. I hit about 12 roos over 3 years with that ute, 3 - 4 big ones, and the bar hardly moved at all. All of the roo strikes were at high speed.

My previous Hilux SR 4x4 had a white smart bar, and when I hit a big roo at 100km/hr between Mildura & Renmark, the roo pretty well destroyed the front end, causing 14k damage, and rendered the car off the road for 8 weeks."

"I have a smart bar. It's had 1 serious strike at its weakest/most flexible point (ie at the outside quarter) and handled it well. I would buy another one as my likely strike rate is low and weight is important to me. Having said that...... If my driving patterns and strike rate were like yours so I had other priorities then would think a big heavy tuff bar would probably win out."

Video of an add for a light, the light was mounted on a tuff bar, I suspect a smart bar would not have copped so well:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rATTBDVt6A

I always find it interesting when manufacturers state there product is better but they never produce proof showing controlled testing of their product against another. I had a quick look at the smart bar website and couldn't see anything on their website so I assume this is the case with them too.

Hopefully I won't have to find out how good or bad the bar is..

I certainly believe the 5 post tuff bar would outperform a Smart bar in an accident.

This video is pretty impressive though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOT5krTPQmQ

I just know I would never get a big heavy ARB delux bar on a 200 ever again.

Don't know about the smart bar video, the calf got up and run away, it appeared to be unhurt, I find that very hard to believe if the car was doing 100Kmh.

Agree with HKB Electronics, no way was the car doing anything like 100 kph. Look at the stopping distance, the car came to almost a complete stop in about 2 seconds.

Macca