WAPOL land search Canning stock route well 22 (lake disappointment)

Additional information on the missing person on the CSR.
Yet to be confirmed by Western Australia police

The missing person's vehicle and girlfriend have been located near well 22. That is according to Facebook page on CSR ???

That's great news. When I read about this Pommy bloke getting lost, I thought about how so many of these people with so little knowledge of the harsh conditions in the Outback, can be allowed to take off up the CSR, without getting some degree of basic bushcraft instruction - such as not abandoning your vehicle!!

Good to hear both of these lost people survived, it could easily have been a double tragedy.

Cheers, Ron.

His vehicle was found 1km north of Well 22 and the guy was found 1km north of Well 22 so not a lot of distance between the two.

Losing the plot on a long desert track is something few people, if any, speak about publically. But privately, relationships are a massive challenge. Just in my research alone, the amount of attempts that failed due to emotional issues is huge.

Wasn't exactly the outcome I was expecting - and as a retired SES who has been on searches where you find "nothing" I was concerned right from outset.

I will concede was one where a sms/pager was sent out numbers of months later referring to a gps co-ordinate saying remains found.

Always remember rule #1 stay with vehicle, but this hardly seems to be adhered to by anybody these days.

Not to mention having the basic essentials such as an EPIRB and/or Satphone !!

I reckon Gaynor has nailed it - and you don't need to be Einstein to figure out what happened here.

She's quite a few years older than him. That's a seniority/experience difference to start with.
I'd say he got the Mitsubishi bogged, and an argument started - either over the de-bogging technique, or him failing to take notice of her advice.

The argument got extremely heated, and a blow-up took place.

She took off to cool down, and either got lost and found the track again - or she decided to walk back down the track, to find some campers they passed, and get de-bogging assistance.
The fact that she found the campers at Well 22, seems to indicate she knew where she was going, and was either following the CSR, or tracking close to it.

I reckon he took off, after cooling down, looking for her - but he quickly got lost.

I've watched some really explosive, hot-tempered blow-ups, over getting vehicles bogged and not taking advice.

The funniest blow-up I ever saw, was an old Italian farmer, and his two sons, at Little Italy, SE of Hyden, in 1974.
It was a really wet Winter and getting wetter, and the old Italian farmer was shifting a 2WD tractor, that he had on the back of a flat-top, 8-tonne Ford Trader.

He wanted to drive the Trader into a paddock to unload the tractor - where myself (earthmoving contractor), and one of my employees (Wayne), and the two Italian sons, were sitting around near our utes, discussing how wet it was, and how it was getting wetter, and it was pointless trying to do anything in the paddocks, because you got bogged everywhere you went.

The old Italian bloke came up to us and told us all he was going to drive the Trader over to a nearby dam bank, back up to it, and unload the tractor on the dam bank.

The two sons and the old Italian promptly got into a heated argument over his plan, with the boys telling him he was wasting his time, and he'd only get bogged.

But the pig-headed old Italian wasn't having any of his upstart sons advice - he knew better, he'd been around for decades longer than them, hadn't he!?

So he jumped into the Trader, roared into the paddock, lined up with the dam bank - tried reversing up - and the old Trader promptly sank to the makers name - on just one side of the rear wheels only - leaving the tractor on a precarious angle, with one side of the tray virtually on ground level!

He jumped out, more furious than ever - and the boys had a wonderful time.
"We told ya, ya silly old fool!!" they chanted.

Well, the old bloke went ballistic with fury, screaming at them. "YES - YOU KNOW!! - YOU KNOW!! - YOU F****** KNOW!! - YOU KNOW IT ALL!!

It was actually quite hilarious, watching it all unfold - and Wayne and I could hardly hold ourselves from laughing.

We jumped in our ute and took off, leaving Dad and the boys hurling abuse at each other - and Wayne and I started killing ourselves laughing, as soon as we got onto the road.

For years afterwards, it was standard technique, whenever an argument started brewing on a jobsite, for either Wayne or myself to come out with - "YES, YOU KNOW!! - YOU KNOW!! - for everyone to start cracking up - and the argument was always promptly defused.

Cheers, Ron.

Accepting that this is all conjecture.....

Ron.... :-) you are assuming she might have been the emotional, irrational one. Read through the various reports again. He is the one who took off south and left her.

There is certainly more to the story than just getting bogged.......

The fact that they turned south is one red flag. They were supposedly heading for Darwin in the north.

The second is that he walked south. Having come through Georgia Bore, he would have known that it was an easy enough walk back to it with guaranteed drinking water. I suspect a quarrel.

I can't help but wonder if he left the woman to make her stress after a fight .... only to return to find out she had walked herself back to water. Personally, I like her style. She was not going to be emotionally manipulated. The woman is the one who kept her head. She went for an easy enough 9km walk back to known water and a 'busy' intersection of Talawana and CSR Track. He went south with clothes and equipment that was later found abandoned. His actions were not logical and I suspect highly emotional.

Why is that every time there is an incident of this nature the armchair experts come out and give there "expert opinion" or their version of events?

None of the parties involved - He, She or the police - have issued a statement of what happened. Why haven't the police issued a statement, with the exception of a statement of know fact? Because they don't yet know!

It's a shame that this type of posting is becoming the norm on this site.

But I suppose there is no point in letting the truth get in the way of a good story!

Cheers

Anthony

That is what forums are about - a lot of opinions and not a lot of facts.

We'll most likely never get the facts, and forums are all about discussions and opinions.
If the discussions lead to some education, some diversity of opinion, and some important points being reinforced, I don't see what the problem is.

Speculation is harmless when no-one has died, and no-one has been hurt - but it could lead to people thinking about the "what-ifs", and what can be avoided with a bit of forethought - and the potential for disaster in remote areas, by simple things like heated arguments.

However, when a discussion with a bit of speculation starts, it always bring out those control freaks who want to shut down the thread.

Those control freaks always have a major inferiority complex problem of their own, because they always refer to others posters, as "armchair experts", to make themselves feel good, by denigrating others - of which posters, they usually know little about their skills, accumulated knowledge, or background.

I'll wager Gaynor has 10 times the intimate knowledge of the CSR, than any other poster on this thread.

It's not likely we will ever know the real reason for this near-disaster - because it will end up buried in SES and police debriefing sessions and statistics - and will only likely end, just with a direct and pointed discussion session between the police, and the couple involved. Lessons learned, move on.

Cheers, Ron.

Guess we'll just have to wait for the Doco.
Dave.

Have to agree with Gaynor - David and I felt the most plausible scenario is they argued. Emotions and stress are the two most dangerous factors of desert travel. Glad it worked out ok for these 2 and yes I admit I'd like to know the full true story...

@ Ron

Obviously your comments were aimed at me!

What's the problem" - It would be OK if the discussions were about batteries or camp chairs, but they are about the lives and emotions of real people - whom you may not even have any sort of relationship with.

There is a forum rule that says I can't "personally attack" someone known on the forum, but you see it as appropriate to speculate and make up, what amounts to rumours about people you don't know. They don't even have the opportunity to respond.

But where in my response have I tried to shut down the thread. My sole message is to point out that the entire thread is based on "lack of facts" and to get people to consider their response and its effect.

I think your statement is a little bit of a personal attack! I don't need to make myself feel good or self important. You also know little about my skills, accumulated knowledge or background - yet you feel the need to mention it in an attempt to "denigrate" me.

I haven't questioned Gaynor's knowledge or experience of the CSR - but I am questioning all those who have responded without full knowledge of the facts.

If Gaynor was replying to a known fact with regard to the reason for the events - all well and good, but she isn't. It may well come to pass that the reasons for the event are as people speculate - at least let the facts come out.

I always ask myself - How would I feel if those types of posts were about me or one of my loved ones. I wouldn't sit by and allow it. I have seen the end result of similar comments on "Social Media"

The owners and moderators of the site have a moral, if not legal responsibility to ensure that this type of rumour mongering doesn't happen. They can't continue to hide behind the "freedom of speech" line.

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." (Edmund Burke)
Cheers

Anthony

ACD - 1 sorry but I need to highlight that ExplorOz site Terms of Use come into play here, it is not as you state, the moral or legal responsibility of the moderators or site owners for what is posted by others.

You are perfectly within your rights to have your opinions as are others and the site caters for those opinions via the Forum.

I have been the following the story since Thursday night, but like many others, found the media coverage to be clearly missing the full story which is to be expected until the facts come out but we are all entitled to acknowledge and even declare our gut instincts - many of us here have experience in this terrain, and experiences when things go wrong, and interests in following such events as they strike terribly close to home and many (like myself) like to think that the more we understand about such incidents is time well spent to better prepare for any mishap that might become us or people we know if the future. All of us here acknowledge that our pastimes do place in circumstances of great risk and for many people its why there is so much preparation before we travel and attention to matters such as survival, first aid, emergency comms, and emergency procedures. We are all human and no one likes to think of harm coming to ourselves or our friends/family/travel companions if we can avoid it. I don't believe any one has malicious intents when discussing these matters.

@ ExplorOz

MIchelle, I am not about to get into a legal stoush with you. However, your own terms of use prohibited the posting of defamatory statements. This is what has happened here. By legal definition the character of the persons involved has been attacked.

If the moral/legal responsibility lay with the poster, why does the site need Terms and Conditions, Forum Rules and moderators to make sure they are adhered too?

At the end of the day both yourself and David derive a financial gain from the site. It is ultimately your reputation! If your happy with it - C'est la vie.

Just as a matter for the record - I am currently preparing for my ninth traverse of the CSR (2018). Previous trips have been both solo and in company of others. I would say I also have significant experience with the Stock Route! Also, My time in the Defence Force and Fire and Emergency Service have given me significant opportunities to experience these types of incidents and their fallout first hand. The impact of how such incidents are reported is significant on those involved and can add to the trauma they have already suffered and indeed the recovery process.

All I am asking is people to consider before posting "made up" facts on public forums.

Once all the brouhaha dies down and the incident is researched in 15 years time - this post will be enshrined as fact - unfortunately such is the beast of the Internet.

Perhaps like the warning for Friday Funnies says - if it's likely to offend don't open it! Maybe I'm over sensitive - maybe I'm the last of those who gives a shit about how my actions affect others!.

Cheers

Anthony

Sorry ACD 1 but again, I have to correct you regarding our Terms of Use. The fact is, nearly everyone makes defamatory statements almost every day. It is done in most forms of speech, all over social media, Forums like this, and by all forms of media. Everyone knows what it is, but only very rarely does someone use the law to sue someone for making such statements. The reason? Defamation law is ponderous and ineffectual - and very very expensive. Our legal consul has advised us how best to deal with it and we are happy with how we've managed over the past 17 years. You've made your points, but it's not your place to tell us what to do in regards any legal responsibility you might presume we have.

We will let the post run its course.

A lot of maybes but another one is maybe she'll leave him.
Another Maybe is better warning signs even though the warnings are good enough.
Then again, some people just can't be told.
When we were in that area last, a lot of signs had been removed or turned facing the wrong way.
The report said that they were totally unprepared & other than being very badly advised there is no excuse for that.

Take care, safe Travels,Ma.

Well said Michelle, luckily the 'bloke' didn't become just another mind numbing statistic of the Pilbara, truth is this saga will be regurgitated by armchair experts who in the most have never been in a situation anywhere near what this couple may have experienced, maybe one day when all the 'social media commentators and outback travel experts' find someone or something new to dissect Mr Collis might tell his version of the story.

I for one think ~ know he's a very lucky man, lucky to be alive that is !

Safe travels : Joe Fury

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Just a quick up date of sorts, Mr Collis walked away from the vehicle for whatever reason, the fact is the vehicle contained ample supplies of food, water, clothing and it was his shelter, the bloke broke just about every rule in the book when it comes to survival in the outback, but he stayed alive for three day/nights by eating bugs and licking/sucking moisture possibly nectar from plants that he saw Camels chewing on, he covered himself with dirt and vegetation in the hole he scraped in the ground to try and stay warm through the night.

Newman has had nightly temperatures in the single digits with crisp desert breezes, temperatures in the sand ridge country of the western deserts at this time of the year fall below zero degrees C

Now he's going to be hailed as a hero of course because he learnt how to survive after watching "Bear Grills" documentaries ~ Truth is he did not look like a 'hero'.

The search plane found the vehicle but not the bloke, heat seeking optics could not detect his body warmth ~ seeing he was in his shallow grave.

Like I said this bloke is very lucky to be alive but I wouldn't bet that dumb luck will save the next 'hero' ~ many people before this bloke have paid the price by breaking the cardinal rule of leaving the vehicle.

Safe travels : Joe Fury

Newman : 7 degrees tonight and 30 degrees tomorrow with a zero chance of rain.

Joe, where did you find this reference?

'....he stayed alive for three day/nights by eating bugs and licking/sucking moisture possibly nectar from plants that he saw Camels chewing on, he covered himself with dirt and vegetation in the hole he scraped in the ground to try and stay warm through the night.'

Curious which media source hails him as a hero.

Hmmm... The Australian is a bit dodgy with this report. Lack of knowledge of the Canning Stock Route.
Well 22 is dry.
Georgia Bore referred to as a miners camp.
And they suggest it was pure luck the woman walked in to Georgia Bore. The couple would have passed it going south and it was only 8km from their bogged vehicle. Fairly obvious she knew where she was headed

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/couple-found-after-wandering-west-australian-desert/news-story/2d73e35d78e12685e4023e459bf97854

No WAYS! According to police, they argued about location, she got out the car and walked back the way they had come and HE LEFT HER, driving into the bush off track until he got bogged!

"The Perth couple who got lost separately in the West Australian desert after an apparent disagreement have reunited in hospital and plan to venture back into the outback together.

Police are bewildered as to how and why Anthony Collis and Debbie Blomfield attempted a shortcut to Darwin, then came to be found three days apart in separate areas of the harsh Gibson Desert, more than 400km east of the iron ore town of Newman.

Senior sergeant Bob Scott of Newman police told Nine News it appeared the couple was on the Canning Stock Route on Thursday afternoon when Mr Collis drove into the bush while Ms Blomfield began walking the sandy stock route.

“All I know is that they were having a discussion about their location and then he drove off into the bush,” Senior Sergeant Scott said. “Whatever went on, police do not want to have to ­rescue them again. I’m assisting them to find their vehicle — they don’t know where it is, and my main concern is that they don’t get lost in my area.

“We’re going to get that ­vehicle — at their cost — and then I’m going to escort them out of my area so put them on the right road to Darwin.”

Ms Blomfield, 39, was dehydrated and disorientated when she walked into a miners’ camp on the stock route about 10pm on Thursday. Mr Collis, 32, was found on Sunday morning after a police plane from Perth delivered Tactical Response Group officers to search with SES volunteers.

At night Mr Collis dug holes and covered himself with branches for warmth as the temperatures dropped to 2C, as he later told police he had seen Bear Grylls do on television. However, he was effectively underground which meant he was virtually undetectable to heat-seeking equipment aboard a search helicopter.

Police came to believe he was either not in the search area, or dead.

“He’d bogged his vehicle and he’d lost where he had that ­vehicle. He had no water and had no food,” Sergeant Scott told Nine News. “He’s broken every rule, every single safety rule and the first one is you don’t leave your vehicle.”

He said there had been water, fuel and warm clothes in the car.

The area is where Bradley John Richards, 40, and his nephew Mac Bevan Cody, 21, died after their car broke down in 2005.'

Lost the plot for sure.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/nation/rescued-couple-to-go-bush-again/news-story/81c97f9a2b3ef3ab2817d5783d608232

OK people, pile in. :)
Dave.

It seems the girl made the right decision to leave the car because the car was going deeper into trouble. I know you are supposed to stay with the car but what if you are on the track and know it leads to a camp, and the car is going to drive off track into the bush to who knows where? Would you stay with the car knowing it is going the wrong way? They still haven't found the car, so they wouldn't have found them yet, or maybe even have known they were missing.
Embarrassing for they guy, it seems he got everything wrong from the information received.

"attempted a shortcut to Darwin",

There is a story waiting to be unearthed.

William